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  • Call me old fashioned, but…

    Posted by Serzi on April 12, 2015 at 12:00 pm

    I’ve probably said this a million times but I don’t see the point of pole being “toned down” to appease the masses. I read some annoying article today regarding the whole “Pole in the Olympics”-controversy and I probably shouldn’t have because I knew it would probably aggravate me. Let me break it down:

    1.) Heels – You don’t have to wear them, you don’t have to like them, but THEY ARE JUST SHOES. Seriously, wtf do people have against wearing shoes while poling? Why is this such an issue with some people?

    “They remind us of strippers!”

    Heaven forbid. We should get rid of the pole, then, somebody may have a flashback of a strip-club they visited in 1998 and find themselves unable to control their sexual urges.

    2.) The word “gyrate” – This article used the phrase “gyrate around the pole” about four times. While by definition this word would be accurate, the context it’s used in is obviously for the purpose of misleading the reader. Here, please allow me to juggle and gyrate my breasts to demonstrate this phrase visually.

    3.) Stricter clothing requirements – Have you ever watched figure skaters or gymnasts or…um…volleyball competitions? These are the most scantily clad professional female athletes I have ever seen and, really, I see no specific purpose for their attire to be that way except to keep them cool as they sweat bullets. Pole competitions often have ridiculously strict rules about choice of clothing (“gluteal crease and cleavage must not become visible at any time”, wtf?) and, truly, better skin contact is a huge part of executing moves safely with proper form. Yes, we all know those people who can dance fully clothed from head to toe and they’re still awesome. I guess my issue is, what is it about pole that makes us have to cover up more? Even fully covered people have complained to me that I have too much ass or boobs showing. Pardon my jiggle-vision, perhaps I should wear a burlap potato-sack to hide any indication that I am an adult female?

    4.) Family entertainment – Seriously? I never realized the Olympics were specifically designed around that core value. I always thought, you know, it was about athletes competing against each other to be awarded the title of “BEST” at what they do. Pretty sure Wheaties boxes and athletes becoming “heroes” or “role models” came after the part of them being unbelievably, mind-bendingly AWESOME at their sport. I suppose, though, competitors of the original Olympic games did so while completely nude and women were threatened with the death penalty if they so much as attempted to watch (let alone compete). Everything changes for a reason, right?

    Idk where I’m really going with this. I’m all for pole being recognized as an actual sport BECAUSE IT IS, but these fruity articles I come across are just too much at times. What is it about pole that brings on so much hate and confusion? It isn’t just the fact that strippers have done it, obviously, as it was undoubtedly aesthetically appealing long before the original poling stripper decided to add the apparatus to her act. I swear, it’s beyond that single perception which brings out such venom and spit at times.

    Serzi replied 9 years, 8 months ago 11 Members · 15 Replies
  • 15 Replies
  • Runemist34

    Member
    April 12, 2015 at 12:32 pm

    I TOTALLY AGREE WITH YOU.
    My goodness, the articles I have read that made me rage all over my house! Who cares about our shoes? They’re fun and they’re sexy sometimes, and we can wear them in HOMAGE to the North American strip clubs from whence a lot of our techniques came from!
    And clothes? Don’t get me started! Have you seen women’s physique/bodybuilding competitions? They’re gorgeous, greased up (I assume), and wearing the littlest bikini’s I’ve ever seen! And yet, that is okay, and Pole is not?
    One of the most infuriating responses I’ve seen is “Because pole dancing is inherently sexual.” OH, I’m sorry! It’s inherently sexual liike… a woman’s body? Or maybe her hair? Perhaps a very tall, straight building that looks somewhat phallic? Or lipstick? Or a man’s feet?
    Sorry, I have some philosophical debate with people on that one that I haven’t been able to actually get out of me. Seriously, though, it’s just seen as “inherently sexual” because it is seen in strip clubs (situational sexuality), because the majority of people who do it are women, and because we’re moving around, and obviously women don’t do those things unless it’s for men! Right? Right??

    People need to get their heads out of their rears and actually start looking around and thinking. Women are people. Men are people. What we do is not necessarily sexual or not, it depends on our context, our intentions, and who we are doing those things with (or not doing those things with).
    *Huff*

  • Cherished

    Member
    April 12, 2015 at 2:33 pm

    Thanks Serzi I love everything you said!

  • tiggertail

    Member
    April 12, 2015 at 6:02 pm

    I try not to read those kind of article, i want to punch people so bad that i decide to stay away from it.

  • ambience24z9338

    Member
    April 12, 2015 at 6:17 pm

    Serzi.. You’re Awesome 🙂 you’re my Olivia Pope for Pole from now on.

  • grayeyes

    Member
    April 12, 2015 at 9:06 pm

    Ditto on the volleyball attire being tiny as well as the body building. I recently saw the men’s bodybuilding competitors when I was at the Arnold–that was one teeny weeny bikini with a whole lot off ass showing–far less clothing than any of the pole competitors were wearing.

  • Lucca Valentine

    Member
    April 12, 2015 at 10:25 pm

    This is coming way out of left field, but the bodybuilding comment made me think of it: the first non racing Olympic event was wrestling….which, at the time, involved two nude men covered in oil and trying to pin each other down. Sorry, this doesn’t contribute much to the conversation, but it tickles me 🙂

  • Lucca Valentine

    Member
    April 12, 2015 at 11:30 pm

    Can’t help but think of Anita Sarkeesian pointing out sexism in video games and the thrashing about that caused…but a similar thing exists in that women playing video games makes certain men feel like they are losing something that THEY OWN. Men (consciously or not) largely feel that they own women in a strip club situation/on par with prostitution. For women to say they enjoy being sexy, pole dancing, etc without their consent/permission…they feel… immasculated I guess? Can’t quite out my finger on it. But it’s undermining a feeling of entitlement and putting something that previously occupied a dark and private corner in their mind and making it totally open and public and NOT F*%#ING THEIRS. So rules are attempted to stop pole dancing from resembling what men associated as theirs. Their dark thing. And women who thrash against it is a similar thing, they associate their husbands/bf’s/fathers/whatever going to strip clubs and cheating/getting drunk/whatever and so that must be the strip clubs faults, the strippers fault, not their husbands. So it’s also some women’s dark thing that they don’t want to be open and public. One course of this could be pole dancing is stripping and stripping is sexual and my husband does things I don’t like at strip clubs so pole dancing is done by women who want to lead other women’s husbands astray. If pole dancing isnt what I can blame my husbands shittiness on then I have to consider that my husband is just shitty vs just being mad at strippers/pole dancing, and that’s just way more uncomfortable. So yeah, that’s my theory for the moment as to why it makes a large sect of people so damn uncomfortable and I do think it is largely an unconscious knee jerk reaction and we are in the process of rocking the boat of change in this arena before we tip it over…and were doin pretty well. Unedited ramble…

  • tacha666

    Member
    April 13, 2015 at 12:58 am

    Totally agree with Serzi and Runemist. Makes me mad as well.
    I guess all we can do is don’t participate in competitios where they don’t let you do certain moves and have these strict costume regulations and continue wearing heels & bikinis and “gyrate” around our poles.

    A friend of mine did an econmics study on negative image as a factor of success on the example of pole dancing and guess what: A lot of people wouldn’t have started if they didn’t think it was sexy. Surprise, surprise.

  • flyingchiro

    Member
    April 13, 2015 at 1:02 am

    To me it’s like this: Pole dancing is an athletic activity (think gymnastics in the Olympics? of course). Pole dancing is a movement art (think ballet in the Olympics?, perhaps? maybe? someday?). Pole dancing is an expressive art (painting in the Olympics? creative writing?, don’t think so). Is the focus on shoes, clothing, sexuality a way of trying to tease these three things apart? Is this focus on the Olympics something we really want to move towards?

  • Serzi

    Member
    April 13, 2015 at 2:13 am

    I’ve always viewed it as you earn respect on your own turf, you don’t dress or act a certain way so people will like and accept you more. Trust me, they WON’T. We can either be the clowns of the Olympics or we can say “You know what? One day your corporate masters will be groveling at our heels because our industry has become so widespread, profitable, and beloved by so many. We don’t even need you to prosper as a recognized sport because we already are.”

  • Lucca Valentine

    Member
    April 13, 2015 at 2:38 am

    I think that all types of pole have a place. There are people who do Olympic/gymnast style pole not because they are trying to convince anyone of anything, but because it’s what they like. Just like there are people who do contemporary style or theatrical style pole because it’s what they like. I don’t dance in heels because i can’t dance comfortably on them and they don’t make me feel sexy (I am a 6′ 3″ awkward clomping giraffe in my heels), not because I’m trying to prove anything to anybody. I think all aspects of pole can exist and it’s beneficial to everyone if they do because that’s how new styles evolves and it’s interesting and fun. The aspect that bugs me is the judgement part and I hope with increasing visibility of these sterile forms of pole that we don’t see increasing back lash and shit talking and essentially attempts at shaming exotic pole into a corner.

  • MD5677

    Member
    April 13, 2015 at 8:29 am

    It’s gonna take some time. I am amazed that something that was taboo in my day has come sooo far as to be talked about as a potential sport. If we keep talking openly, honestly, and calmly progress will continue. Also, there will always be those who choose to hate – mostly out of fear. Those you gotta just ignore and hope they either jump on or get run over by the bandwagon!

  • Serzi

    Member
    April 13, 2015 at 9:12 am

    Exactly my point. Pole has always had a place for Olympic athletes. I figure enough time of us having competitions with our own wide variety of categories, performing and competing in larger outside events that welcome us, and our growth as a community will one day earn us a spot in the Olympics on our own terms. Yeah, okay, whatever if you don’t want to wear heels but don’t adhere to that bs as a requirement either way. Don’t let anyone force you to wear heels or to not wear heels because there’s NOTHING WRONG WITH EITHER WAY. To adhere is to admit fault in it and that is something I genuinely believe will divide and conquer this industry if we let it.

  • SToast

    Member
    April 13, 2015 at 9:55 am

    I like that pole can go both ways. You can wear sweat pants and a tank top and bust out some serious strength moves. Moves that leave people in awe of your ability to lift your self slowly off the ground until you are parallel. But you can also put on some booty shorts, heels, and a bikini top and rock the sexy, sensual, girl power aspect. I guess, for this reason, I don’t see the problem with competitions limiting wardrobe. As I understand it, there are some that do and some that don’t. I think, in a lot of aspects, it is good that pole is getting a cleaner reputation. It’s getting more women excited and interested in it. But I also believe that once you start, you realize that less clothes = more advanced moves. I think it helps women open up to their sexy side at whatever speed they are comfortable with.

    Personally, the sheer strength that it takes to do some of these moves is what got me interested in the first place. The amazing confidence that comes along with pole was just an amazing fringe benefit. I am not a “prude” by any means, but two years ago I wouldn’t have been caught dead in booty shorts and a bikini top in front of other people. Now, I think I own more “pole” shorts than regular shorts.

    I guess my point is that if some people only want the focus to be on the strength aspect then so be it. Far be it from me to force them to recognize the sensual side of pole. But I think that most people, even if they start out ignoring it, come to embrace and enjoy that sexy side. And for those of us who like it sexy from the get-go there are the “Bringing Sexy Back” competitions and pole expo 🙂

  • Serzi

    Member
    April 13, 2015 at 10:46 am

    All great points here, I like where this discussion is going. 🙂

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