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Pole dancing in the Olympics
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I would not like Poledancing to be in the Olympics. I agree with everyone of the above who doesn't! I think it would make things a lot more difficult for "normal people", it would become a sport for gymnasts only. Or do you know anybody who started taking classes at Rhythmic Gymnastics at the age of 45? Neither do I.
I like the fact that everybody, no matter what age or size, can participate in this wonderful sport called pole dancing! And it's dancing, after all, not only inverts and those very sporty things. All this would change so much if it became a part of the Olympic Games. Don't like. Not at all.
Sure, I might change the opinion of some prude and unknowing people towards "vertical gymnastics" or whatever they'd call it then – but would it change their attitude towards us, the everday normal girl wanting to work out and having fun? We'd still be looked at as sluts and strippers, not being 14 and/or extremely skinny, but working out at home, with the pole standing in our house. OMG, it's in the bedroom?? You pervert! https://www.studioveena.com/img/smilies/icon_eek.gif
And I completely agree with one of the ladies above who stated, that other forms of dance such as ballet don't need to be in the Olympic Games to be great and to be highly appreciated in the world. BTW, did you know that the WALTZ was actually considered to be objectionable for a very long time? Things take their time, for God's sake. Poledancing has come up as a sport only in the last 10 years or so – why hurry!
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I just wanted to chime in with a few thoughts..since several people seem to be misled about WHY pole dancing is going into the Olympics.
One of my very best friends, and my mentor in pole dancing, started this concept and is the VP of the Pole Sports Org. I myself am the chair of the technical committee.
So I am in a position to state WHY the people who are doing this are actually doing it:
We are not looking for acceptance or recognition by people who currently do not approve of pole dancing. In fact, at this point we have decided, it is not even going ot be called pole "dancing".
It will be a whole new use of a vertical pole, just as Chinese pole is a different use of a vertical pole.
Finally,. speed skating and figure skating are both in the Olympics and that has not changed the fact that people everywhere still lace up their skates and enjoy good old fashioned skating in rinks and on ice ponds and no one is trying to stop them.
For those who are not aware of it, the Olympic bid for pole is very real and a lot of work is already under way. It will not even be close to an Olympic event in 2012 as it requires years of preliminary work and regional competitions as an organized sport but most likely by 2012 you will be hearing about those preliminary events.
If you are curious, you can check out http://www.PoleSports.org
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Other than having a….somewhat….ummm….less than modern looking? website (just my opinion as an industry professional – I really hope they didn't pay for it) I really think that our IF is doing a pretty good job and is really on the right track.
There are a couple cosmetic rule changes I'd like to see so that we are more like other artistic sports. the first one is that I don't think props should be allowed in compeition -now that dosn't mean we can have a gala show at the end of the compeition like Rhythmic Gym does.
like so
Competition: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x5nRFvuyEl8
Gala: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tgQcEQ4Ddrc&feature=related
the other thing is just costumes/presentation. There really should be a limit on how much skin is to allowed to be exposed, and clothing should not be allowed to be removed. and serious dedictions for vulgarity. now thats not to say you can't dance however you like in your gala performance. Just not when you're in front of the judges. 🙂
annother example from RG
Comptition: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vt4zrF0m2aA
Gala: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yBgBaGsHIdg
anyway…that's just my two cents 🙂
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Wow, this topic has certainly exploded!
I figured I would add my humble opinion, though hopefully I won't be repeating some other topics already discussed.
I would prefer if Pole dancing was somewhat more regulated, but not completely. I enjoy the fact that a lot of it is all about interpretation…rather than having everything laid out, we're allowed to explore and experiment, we're allowed to dance, and thus express. If it was ALL regulated and set down, we'd all have the same moves, and we would all look pretty much the same. This is a big reason why I can't tell one gymnast from another…
However, I've thought about Pole dancing in the Olympics…and, well, I don't agree with it. Since pole dancing has that sexy aspect, a lot of the moves are splay-legged and such, to remove the sexy would be to take away a huge part of it, for me. It's like trying to take away the nudity from Burlesque…it's possible, but it's also not really Burlesque, is it?
And, if we kept the sexy, think about it this way…when do people start training for the olympics? At what age do our athletes start? Do you REALLY want a child working on moves like this? I sure wouldn't! Sex (and sexiness) is the privilege of the adult, so I get really weird about children engaging in some of these things. They may not know what it is the move is meant to do, and they may be innocent…but, again, would you want a kid on stage doing Burlesque?
I see it kind of like cheerleading right now, where we're at. It's huge, it's getting accepted…but we're not a "sport," even if we are doing something that people can get injured doing. I think that's the first (and, perhaps only) step I would be comfortable with…recognition as a sport or style of dance. Keep it accessible.
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https://www.studioveena.com/img/smilies/icon_heart1.gif thank you Runemist, you managed to express my thoughts better than I did 😉
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Sanchara…thank you for your input. I cannot say who designed the website as I was not involved in that but since we are a non-profit organization, and so far everything and all time is coming out of our own pockets, I'm guessing we did not pay a professional to design the site.
Both of your suggestions are already a part of the framework we have started in our guidelines: props will not be allowed and we are developing specific guidelines about costumes (uniforms) and that includes skin coverage.
Runemist – Yes we do foresee that some day this sport may well be taken over by those who began training at a young age just as many of the gymnastics events currently have evolved but I don't understand your questioning how we feel about these "children" training to do sexual/sensual moves since we are pretty clear that this will not be a sensual but an athletic performance just as all other gymnastics are.
We do not expect to see hip circles, grinding, body waves, etc. in these events and in fact there will likely be prohibited moves.
Will some perverts still associate this with sexuality? I'm sure they will but sadly there are perverts who associate EVERYTHING with sex including the young girls figure skating and doing floor and rhythmic gymnastics in leotards.
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I forgot to add further thoughts:
The splay legged moves are included in all these other gymnastics (and the same perverts view it they way they wish to) but it doesn't mean that the moves are sexual.
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As a serious ex gymnast I am torn…on one hand I love the idea of and the passion in the attempt to have pole dancing accepted into the Olympics however for me the whole issue is about passion. And let's be real if this does work out it will NOT be pole dancing as most think of it currently. To me the beauty of pole dancing is the passion, the sensuality AND the athleticism. The only way it will ever be accepted is to become sanitized and just another gymnastics event. So then – for me at least – really what's the point…you lose the beauty – you lose the passion and you end up with just another gymnastics event (vertical/aerial bar or whatever), with a bunch of 13 year olds competing. Not really interested in another gymnastics event in the Olympics – but in all fairness, I was, and am still against Rhythmic Gymnastics in the Olympics as well.
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persoanlly I can't see Pole Sport ever becoming an early specialzation sport like women's artistic gymnastics becuse the strength and complexity components. I think it will most likely remain a late development sport like Equestrian Vaulting or Men's gymnastics where the bulk of the elite level competitors are in their 20s. Even in RG those at the olympics are in the 17 – 26 range. I don't really see any reason what younger athletes could not train in it though. And I have felt for a long time the at slutty side of pole dance needs to go. Now that's not to say a routein can't have a certian aspect of sensuality to it. Look at the woman who was silver at Worlds this year. I think there was something really beautiful and sexy about her tango routeine…but it was subtle and that's what made it sexy rather than skanky.
Empyrean. Don't worry about it if I knew who to get in touch with I would volonteer my time but I don't so…yea…(That kind of thing is what I do for a living – I especially like building sites for things I am interested in. I'm actually finishing the last touches on the new look for our vaulting NF's website today.)
I have a question, are the international rules going to be made public like the FEI and FIG have done? becuse I feel that that gives the IF a certian appearance of accountability (that is 100% personal opionion tho)
I really wish I could be more involved. This is such a pivotal and exciting time for our sport but with everything I'm already involved with in the Vaulting world there just isn't any room left on my plate. 🙁
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The founders of this sport are strippers, and we shouldn't ever forget that. Working in a strip club is the equivalent of working construction as a man–it's backbreaking and thankless. Legitimizing the sport is all well and good, but I don't think we should ever try to erase the sensual roots of this sport, which was developed by women working tough jobs who were villified (and still are) for working those jobs.
Wherever we end, we should remember where we started.
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As both a pole dance instructor and as a member of of the IPSF I don't want, nor do I need, pole dancing to be "accepted" by anyone.
In fact I'd probably be a bit disappointed if the sensual aspect of pole dancing was "accepted" by everyone! At least no more so than to recognize that I have a right to do things and enjoy myself in any way which does not harm another human being.
But then again, those of us who are actually working to get pole sports in the Olympics see it as pole sports not pole dancing and it's just another sport.
Sanchara…too bad you don't have time to volunteer. We need more help. We've not made final decisions but based upon others on the committee and our current opinions I'm guessing we will publicly list rules and guidelines when they are finished….which is still a long ways off.
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I hope you didn't think that I was complaining about the sensuallity – what I have a hard time digesting is the sensationalizim – I think compeititon should be about who can do bigger skills and cleaner routeins not about who can take their clothes off the best. My all time favortite routein is Felix's Guns and Roses one from worlds 2009. I just wish it were a little more subtle….more godess less street corner if you catch my drift. But I agree – what rec folks do in their living rooms has nothing to do with what the elite atthletes do at interntional compeitions.
Something like a website that's a one-time thing with a little maintence here and there I can handel. 🙂 'sides it would be fun. But I don't think being involved on a deeper level would be a good idea considering I don't compete nor can I see myself being at that level any time soon….
Aerial – Rhythmic Gymnastics belive it or not came from one woman who danced with scarves to entertain men – now she did it wearing clothes – but the sport has done everything it can to forget that passed. that dosn't mean there aren't still women who dance with scarves out there….they just can't call themselves Rythmic Gymnasts.
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I'm not really worried about rhythmic gymnastics–that's already been killed. We're talking about pole dancing, and I'm worried about sports officials and gymnasts appropriating the moves and setting standards without giving credit where credit is due.
Distinguishing between what is "goddess" and "street corner" is a little tougher than simply deciding what you think–once you begin trying to pin down a sport that leaves so much room for interpretation, it is bound to suffer. Not in the hands of its true advocates, of course, but in the hands of those who feel it needs to be "cleaned up" for the masses.
I will never watch pole in the Olympics if it's simply a bunch of women pulling off tricks, and I will never stop getting the message out that we came from strip tease, and there's nothing wrong with strip tease. People can change it all they like and try to hide behind a set of standardizations so they won't feel queasy about seeing a little skin, but that belies years of hard work by underrepresented women in the sex industry. I guess each side will have to continue pretending the other doesn't exist–as I've unfortunately seen all too often in the pole-dancing world.
Pole-dancing is at its heart an expression of strength and femininity, but it is also a rebellion against social norms and an attempt to gain control over our own sexuality. Without that uneasy alliance, I agree that pole-dancing could be just a sport. 😉
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I'm not embarrassed about the "roots" of pole dance and I hope everyone isn't trying to legitimize it by "sporting" it up. I can appreciate the athletic aspect of it that has its own appeal….but my PERSONAL passion for pole comes from the expression and art that can be created between the dancer and the pole. I am woman, I am sexy, and I am not ashamed https://www.studioveena.com/img/smilies/icon_queen.gif If pole is ever an Olympic sport it will not be the pole dance I love, but rather a vertical bar placed in with other gymnastics type apparatuses, The thought of that doesn't thrill me.
Oh one other thing, I don't think of splayed legs as sexual….in my mind its just a variation of splits that's all. BUT…You can add things like lyrics or the tone of the overall performance and that could make it more sexual. I also don't think there is anything wrong with my boys also having fun on the pole. It is what you make it. I could make a chair seem pretty damn DIRTY but its still just a chair! hehe!!
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