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Teaching Pole and ACTUALLY Making Money
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what she said^^^ this women is a genious seriously
i wantvto share andvits not a secret , that i failed with my first studio big time!!
i tryed to bounce back by rebting by the hour and its the only way for me that has been lucretive so far, i also recommend to have a real job too , you cant make a living teaching pole!
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Webjunk, all good valid points! I’m not suggesting a one size fits all solution with my book, in fact there are several options with in. I’m just telling what’s worked extremely well for me and many others, WHY it worked and exactly how to do it, i.e. Negotiating a split of profits 70/30, instead of paying a flat rate. A lot of it I got to experience first hand. One of the studios I worked at, Nothing But Class, was open 7 years! I learned quite a bit from that place, including how to structure classes and parties and why you should in the first place. It makes a difference!
I don’t want anyone to think I am suggesting one solution can solve your problems, but in reaching out and talking with different studio owners I was surprised at how many of us were having similar issues. I am really passionate about this book, and I know myself and several other polers put A LOT into teaching our classes, and performing, just the pole community as a whole. It can be hard to give out of yourself when you’re worried about paying studio bills as an owner or concerned whether or not your studio will be open as an instructor. That frustration is multiplied when your classes are full and the feeling is that you can’t possibly do anything more! In my experience it tends to be the money issue, not advertising, that keeps pole studios from being profitable.
Regardless, I’m here to help! My thing is setting yourself up as an independent contractor and how to do that. I can help. If you have a question, please ask me, I’d love to help you in any way I can! And I think we can agree Webjunk is an excellent source of help and knowledge for studio owners needing some help!
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I love the idea of this book! I would like to see something for those of us that have our own studio. I was not able to gain access in any existing facility here to “Rent” some space from them. Most of our gyms/fitness facilities are owned by the major hospital, colleges, and the few in the private sector still believe it teaching women to strip for our only gentleman’s club in town! LOL
As for S.C.O.R.E, here they were not helpful at all! They set me up with a mentor (that was 5 years ago) and all he did when we talked about what I was planning, was hand me a packet and said to read it and fill out a business plan! I asked several times to have my questions answered on allot of the “How to do it”, what needed to be included, what was I missing etc! I had to research and try to speak with local business people, (which were not to helpful, they didn’t want any part of what I was doing, even in conversation!) I couldn’t get a loan because of the type of business. I started with $131 in cash, (all the money I had!) and 3 personal credit cards. I am coming up on my 4th year in a physical studio this November 8th. It has been, and still is a challenge on a daily basis. Because it is service based and not tangible product like retail, it presents it’s own unique challenges.
I would have received my 1st paycheck last year, but had so many issues in my previous space with the management and other businesses. I had to negotiate out of my lease to move. I’m in a temp space now, my new space will be completed hopefully by October1! I have a better landlord without all of the previous issues, and he is building it to suit my needs! I’m hoping for a paycheck by the end of this year! 🙂
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Please everyone understand. I am trying to be helpful for those currently in a pole business or thinking of one. If you are willing to read the book then hopefully you can make your way through my rambling!
You said “In my experience it tends to be the money issue, not advertising, that keeps pole studios from being profitable”
That is like saying “I only need medicine to treat my disease.” If only it was that easy. I am struggling with this issue first hand. Am trying to get on a medicine that is $16,000 (IV Infusion) per treatment. Need a local doctor (Mayo Clinic already has specified this is the medicine of last resort for me.) to sign the orders and then submit to my insurance to see if they would cover part of the cost. The local doctor wants to repeat tests done 2 months ago that insurance will not again pay for. And insurance I already know will at least deny my coverage for the medicine at least the first time. (Sorry for venting about my medical issues! But there is a point I promise)It is the same in business. It is the details that matter. Yes money is in business what will pay the expenses of the business and hopefully pay your own income to some extent. But how do you get that money? Can we all here say together ‘Cause #3: “Business is not easy.”‘
You need to advertise whether it be word-of-mouth, social media, websites, print media or whatever but something targeting the demographics that match your area to get the interest of potential students & customers. Then attract them through phone calls, websites & emails to actually visit your place. Then have a decent sales pitch & visual presentation to sell them on your classes and so they actually hand over that money you think is so easy to get.
On the other side, is no business will have unlimited funds. So how all expenses which includes advertising are handled can be equally important.I was not going to comment on the book here (Jenae was kind enough to email me a copy) but a couple of individuals had asked me to here. And it is important for a lot of people here. I promised her not to divulge the content but will instead focus on what is NOT in the book.
First for people like @litlbit this book will not be helpful. It does not cover a studio owner but is about renting space from a gym. Sorry SCORE did not help you. They are each human and you can get good ones or bad ones.
There is a lot of arbitrary numbers. There is a brief paragraph on estimating business. It is an arbitrary number. She does not explain how she reaches it or how to determine for your own area and market. As planning is extremely important that is proving the point of Cause #1.
Some things were not properly researched. She lists the cost for a group fitness certification. That is the approx. cost for the test only. Not for the most important study materials which are several times the price of the test and I can count on one hand how many people on this planet can pass those tests without the study materials. Also no mention that in order to keep those certification you must spend money each year for continuing credits. She does “recommend” getting a CPR cert but again proper research would turn up that any fitness cert requires not only CPR but AED certs.
She gives the cost RANGE for liability (she calls it something else) insurance but it is a range of several thousand dollars. Hardly helpful in planning. Here she points you to doing a Google search for more info. Would prefer in things like this that she does the due diligence of a few minutes to provide some specifics. As I said before in business its in the details and the book is missing most of the details. Pole expense also is a large range with options (brand, size, etc.) what everyone here already knows and has been discussed in greater detail.
Expenses per month might be reasonable for Norman, Oklahoma but doubt it will work for California, New York, Michigan, Ohio, London, Melbourne, (You get it!) She did have a form with expenses but can someone tell me why you need a few hundred dollars of welding per month? And no expense for advertising?There are a number of business details specific to a pole business that were not mentioned at all.
First while this requires you purchase the poles (to me a debatable issue for an alternative business plan not mentioned) she directs that you might need to “simply cut a hole” (sorry that was directly from the book) in a ceiling. No mention about asking permission let alone that it must be permission in writing!
There is something like 2 or 3 sentences dedicated to discussing an independent contractor agreement. This would be the contract between yourself and the studio/gym. She barely touches on it and only as it regards the poles being used. I would have much preferred if she only included a sentence asking the reader to retain an attorney for creating or reading any contract. That would have had more value. The paragraph is a little murky of you can do this, or maybe this or maybe this. No mention about an Exclusivity agreement, Non-Compete clause or Non-disclosure. Without specific language the agreement may have no legal meaning. Also missing and I want to stress to people here, If you install permanent or even semi-permanent poles in someone else’s studio property, legally (at least here in the states) you have made an improvement to their property and it becomes part of their property. In plain English, if you install poles in a studio they can now claim they own your poles. You must clearly state in your contract signed by a person in Ownership (not just a manager) that you retain ownership of your poles. Again she provides generalities but not the important details.Further as the book describes being only a subcontractor (she completely discourages you from owning an actual studio yourself) then its the studio’s business.By default you cannot just take THEIR students & members and open up shop elsewhere. In fact if you do not have permission from the studio you cannot even market to their members for your classes. Sorry folks but its the world we live in. Would have been nice to show a sample contract at the least.
Without everything spelled out in writing and agreed with. You can setup the room & poles; arrange the classes & schedule; draw in students and they can then throw you out on your butt and continue it themselves. That is one of the reasons it may be a better reason to ignore this book and start your own studio.
If you are not good with the legal stuff, PLEASE Hire an attorney even if just for an hour.Although on this website she seems to have an aversion to advertising, she touches on it in within a few paragraphs. A lot that will not work in other areas. Once again, demographics change everywhere. And how do you take a picture of your entire pole class before you even have your first class? Makes my head explode like the Big Bang Theory. (the theory not the TV show, tho’ love the show!)
Now I must apologize because I am the one who is writing a book here. Mine its not for sale, sorry. But welcome to ask questions on here for free. Just want to protect those that think there is much to it. Give up your day job and try invest a few thousand of your money? Want to help you before you make any decisions and a few that already have.
In closing (finally right?) the book is only 54 pages of content with extremely large print and five pages of forms. I see she dropped the price today to $35 from $50 yesterday. That’s still 60¢/page without a lot of substance or details. It focuses almost exclusively on what she did. Sometimes briefly touching an alternative but before explaining anything discouraging you from going in another direction. It misses a tremendous amount of details I barely touched on here.
I would love to see a book about the pole business with details that would provide assistance, allowing for variations in geographic area, economy, type of pole business, etc. Also equally important but missing from the book is what to do when things go wrong as they will at some point. The economy drops out like in 2008; the fitness center closes down suddenly; you have an accident with a student. Even the Stock Market is fantastic except for when the stock goes down.
Sorry everyone for being long winded. I wasn’t going to post about the book but a couple of people asked me to. Hopefully a lot of this information can be taken in a productive light of what else there is to know for a pole business.NOTE: I personally have a request of everyone on here. Its okay if no one agrees. I myself and other people I think would find more benefit if people who are currently in a pole related business or have been in the past can post details of their business. Start a new discussion for it. Do not have to give specific numbers. I have been involved in a number of business roundtables and panels over the years. Sort of doing the same on here. Helpful to know planning, demographics, advertising & marketing, expenses, contracts & agreements, facilities, issues, and anything else that matters.
Both the good and even bad when something has gone wrong. It would help those thinking of starting a business as well as those currently in business. It always helps to know what works and doesn’t even though it will be different for many. I know some people get frightened about “Competition” but I have already expressed privately to three people that it is not necessarily a bad word. In contrast it can be a strength to leverage. So do not think it will be used against you. Sharing will help everyone including yourself. Just an idea.
Thank You and apologies if you read all of this. Have a Super day! -
Not quite sure, you read the book all or looked at the spreadsheets very well, as I did not say I was budgeting $200/mo for welding. That was how much I paid during that month to have pole mounts removed and that particular spreadsheet was actual income/expenses for that month.
Lilbit, my book primarily focuses on contracting through a gym/studio as way to START. For those of use who don’t have a few thousand dollars stocked away or don’t want to go into debt, this is an excellent way to figure out if it’s what you really want to do or if you can handle running your own pole business. I DO give exact figures (don’t price your classes under $10, pay split 70/30) and have received feedback from a few others on here that the pricing and class structure information were spot on from their experiences. Regardless, the information regarding how to structure your classes, parties and price them applies to an independent contractor or a studio owner. I don’t expect everyone to agree with everything in the book.
Regarding the price change, I was testing the checkout software and had arbitrarily picked a price. If I can save you money/time with things I have learned myself and from studio owners OUTSIDE of Oklahoma $34.99 is a great price.
Thank you to those of you who have been very supportive! I enjoy the fact that women in the pole community build each other up! I appreciate that very much. Webjunk, when your pole business book comes out let me know. I’d love to read it. Until then, if you’d like to purchase mine you can. If anyone has any questions, please feel free to message me as I don’t want to keep going back and forth on this post or feel like I should have to defend my point of view. Love you all!
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Attached is the expense report from the book you sent me. You have welding as projected $200 and actual $120. Now I am not sure how you know the actual expenses for a month we are less than a week into. It cannot be from last year because according to the Yogalife website you started earlier this year. Whether you call it welding or “pole mounts removed” it does not sound to me (admittedly someone w/o a pole business) like a regular expense. That is why I made note in my last post. You list a somewhat unique expense like that but do not list normal expenses like advertising, insurance, telephone, etc. that all pole businesses would have. I did state that your book seems to be a template only for your particular instance and missing a lot of details for others.
Your exact figures (which are few) are again specific to your instance. No Classes under $10. Probably generate a laugh in some parts of the country that would double that figure. The pay split is something that needs to be negotiated. You miss the negotiation process entirely. It is not one-sided. Any split has to be agreed by the fitness center and they may have their own figure in mind.This worked for you but it is too specific to work in very many other instances. Other things in your book are too general or not researched enough to give some proper direction or to plan a business.
Maybe I will at some point write a book about a pole business. Don’t be surprised if a link pops up on here to download a book. But I will be the first to admit that there is much I still have to learn.
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Have talked & helped some pole studios and other pole businesses, especially this year. Thought about a book but the industry is changing fairly quickly, so a book can in part go out of date quickly. Wanted to also reach the widest audience and various types of pole businesses. So setup a website. Can be found at:
http://PoleBiz.com
It still has a way to go. Adding when I can, have the energy (health issues) & in the mood. All the information is Free and I never plan on charging to view articles. Hoping to develop the Pole industry as a whole which, should help with acceptance by the general public. The articles will also get updated when the need arises so check the dates.
Probably a lot of spelling mistakes & grammar. I welcome all comments, criticisms & suggestions. If anyone has anything they would like to see or can provide would love to hear from you as well.
polebiz.com
Give it a Spin! -
and your advices are very appreciated! Thanks a lot!
Sometimes it can be hurtful to hear the truth on abusiness you worked on with all your heart…. but a business is a business and we are there to make money!
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Yes 0LlVlA, people often take criticism of a business, personal. But part of being a business person is separating the two.
Most people unfortunately jump into a business without knowing what they are getting into. It often sounds so easy to start but am sure you know even if the business is part-time, it can be a full-time job.
I am not trying to discourage people from starting a pole related business. On the contrary, I hope to help them. I welcome comments. -
Why would the landlord claim they owned the poles? They would maybe make a claim to the mounts but the poles, not being themselves attached to the space couldn’t be considered a capital improvement any more than my floating mirrors resting on the tracks I put on the walls. Certainly the tracks could be considered an improvement as they are attached to the walls, but the mirrors are not permanent and couldn’t be considered a change tot he structure…I mean really would a landlord lay claim to a picture I hung on the wall using a picture track?
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Especially considering that the poles come in carrying cases because they are bought as portable poles…
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Portable poles should not be mounted to the structure so would never apply. Permanent type poles are a different story. Your lease should have a section called “leasehold improvements†that may be more specific and if exists overrides the law. That is why you should include it in your lease and specify about poles.
Not every state or country describes it exactly the same but most state law it comes down to whether it can be removed without leaving damage. Some states it includes anything that is an added value to the leased space. The law applies whether you are the original lessee or are subletting. It is meant to include permanent fixtures like sinks, lights, flooring, etc. But like anything else people sometimes use the law to their advantage. Realize if you mount poles into steel ceilings, leaving holes is damage. Of course it might be worked out to pay for damage rather than leave the poles as most property owners are more interested in the property. Although metal girders need to be welded which can get expensive. As to the question about taking the poles and leaving the mounts, that would be like leaving the faucet which is attached and taking the sink.
I have an article about leases at: http://polebiz.com/leases/ -
You managed to make a lot of assumptions about structures I might have and didnt ask a single question for clarification. X poles have the ability to be inserted in a ceiling mount (which X pole sells for just that purpose–or did you not know that?) So they ARE portable AND can be inserted into a ceiling mount.
You mentioned you had business experience. What kind of business? If you are advising perhaps you could provide specific bona fides regarding type nature income and duration of your business(es). -
Wow. There’s being constructive and then there’s being a ‘holier than thou know it all.’ Jenae James, I will be reading your book. I started teaching and then quit because a big pole company came to my town and wiped the floor with me. I’d like to hear your perspective 🙂
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@deb5600
I was in no way giving you specific legal advice nor should I. It also appeared you were asking a generic question which is what I answered.Regardless of the type of mount, it comes down more importantly to your lease (a legal document) and laws governing. For the pole, the type of mount is fairly irrelevant. It is the damage it causes and/or whether it will be considered a change according to “leasehold improvements.â€
Leaving the mounts & taking the poles is alright in your opinion. That counts no more than my opinion, which is why I won’t give specific legal advice. It becomes a legal question. Ask any Real Estate attorney for their opinion.
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